New Players and Old: Death & You!

[Maina]

Kaiser, you really have no idea whether you’ve played with me or not. I make an effort to keep my Account name and PC name separate because of people like you who use it as a weapon. So insisting I’m making stuff up when you don’t even know who I am is absurd. I was part of several scenes with you, whether you know who I was or not.

Have other people behaved toxicly in this thread? Absolutely. But this thread is about you. You made it about you. And other people behaving badly does not justify you behaving even worse. Especially not when you baited them into it with easily-verifiable lies and unsubstantiated vitriol.

I quit these forums for years because I found Crayon just that impossible to deal with, but you are behaving so poorly that I dragged myself back into the darkness just to defend them and say that, for once, we agree: Crayon is right about you. You are the problem here.

I think if you just took a few days away from crashing out on a public forum, you might be able to see that and be better. Obviously, this isn’t fun for you. Maybe consider less about who is right and who is wrong and consider instead what course of action will lead to you and those around you having more fun.

[Luka]

Mojojojo you’re reaching Kaiser levels of unhinged, might be time to take a step back and take a breath. It’s not that deep.

[Kaiser]

Lies, lies, lies, she took it OOC and said the following, “this isn’t a hack and slash game, stop being a bad faith actor, and he has mental issues.” She came into my tells via Aid, breaking rule 2, and accused me of not roleplaying and demanding a response. Aka harassment, no matter how you dress it up just because she used nice language. The intention, once again, was never to kill her or maim her, and you exaggerating a critical wound inflicted through a mistake makes you once again a spinster. Captain Hindsight strikes again. Shit happens, it was sorted, it was RP’d, and it was laid to rest. You all decided to raise this zombie from the grave.

Lord, yep, sure, whatever you say, apparently critical wounds last a week, and severe wounds longer. You’re just talking out your ass and don’t know anything. This isn’t H6. I chose violence? It’s fucking game man, get a grip. Make believe, not real, she was in no real harm, I had no super secret evil plan to murder her because execute does the job a hell of a lot better. If you paid attention to half my arguments explaining this you wouldn’t keep drudging it up.

You don’t have to say it you act like it, look back and reflect, do better. I can’t hold you hand walk through every line where you demand my attention, demand how I should respond, and demand how I should beg for forgiveness while offering no charity in return.

She did not just address it “icly.” But sure, let’s go with that. Remind me again what OOC chat, tells, and the forums are? Oh yeah, not IC.

Clearly I’m not just talking about you Mojo, the world doesn’t revolve around you, yet again. I’m fighting off 20+ assholes who all need their turn to lambast me. Holy shit, it’s like you choose to ignore whatever narrative doesn’t fit yours.

I dont’ owe you anything, especially acting like a child who can’t “take two seconds” to say in AID, “hey what’s up, are you greifing me, do you need to be somewhere?” Take some of your own medicine.

I don’t care who you know, I never accused you of being in league with a clandestine group of super villain’s.

Look at yourself, saying I shifted goal posts when I never moved from mine, go to my long explanation after Bean’s accusation, it’s still been the same. I know it’s hard for you to keep up, but try, Leon acted on her actions, he was nearly dead, and she started attacking him. After the fact it was revealed she flubbed an input, it was handled all IC until she and ALL OF YOU brought here, made it an issue in OOC chat, and decided it’s okay to say how she was owed my attention and time, even though she wasn’t being kind, empathetic, or nice at the time. This is called revising history. AKA LIES.

Sister I’m not holding my piss and shit for you or anyone, miss the world has to move at your beck and command. Get the hell over your mist farming screw ups.

I’m talking about your OOC hate mongering, stay on topic, go back, I don’t care about the IC events when all you’ve done so far is spread OOC slander and hate.

I didn’t say just grab the guns. God you love your lies and mischaracterizations.

[Kaiser]

@maina The absolute moral smugness, I genuinely hate people like you. What lies? What OOC lies did I spread? Nah, you’ve never Rp’d with me on any meaningful level if Icly you came to the conclusion, “the problem.” I’m suspecting I know who you are, and you are looking at everything from bias and someone else’s narrative if you’re not who I think you are.

Go on point out how I didn’t give what I didn’t receive, where I started off first. Unless you are going to really say Crayola did nothing wrong.

IC everything comes at a point of view, whether you want to believe one side or the other is on the onus of said PC.

Here we go again with character assassinations. I but you believe it’s okay to make demands of strangers and talk to them in private without their permission, while making snide and passive-aggressive comments. Go on say it: it’s a collaborative game. Yet while offering nothing in kind and painting one side as wholly wrong and one side a wholly innocent.

Good for you?

Did you really just come in here to tell me how bad I am? Do you think I’m suddenly going to Obama meme and think, “she’s got a point?”

[MojoJojo]

How am I, Luka? Do elaborate. I’m not fuming here. I am sitting through a lazy shift at work and have little else going on but getting to enjoy the sunny early evening. And I mean… Look at what he replied with this time.

I’m not even responding to whatever trash Kaiser wrote out this time. He continues to rant and spew lies around, but yes – All of us are lying, again. This narrative of his is just ridiculous. Not the first time we’ve seen him spin a false narrative and then vehemently and toxically attack anyone who doesn’t take his fake stories as the goddamned truth. Incessant ‘no u’ing. Sticking his head in the sand like an ostrich when any response doesn’t agree with him.

Homey staked a PC for a reason nobody thinks justifies such a fucking hostile and crippling response. Got his teeth kicked in. Cries and calls everyone every filthy name under the sun, and we are all lying and colluding against him. Fuck off with this shit. That’s clear as day.

At this point, I am literally starting to hope they keep getting no-RP ganked. They’ve become our second RG at this point. Newbie rants. Forum rants. Uncalled for hostility and aggression. Just one step away from pretending they have friends on the dark web, or with the FBI, who will DDoS Haven or find us IRL.

[MojoJojo]

I’ll be the first. Crayola did nothing wrong.

Mistargeting because of weird Illusory Mancing tricks isn’t ‘doing something wrong’. Mistakes happen, to err is human. She immediately did the adult thing and tried clear the air, and apologized. She didn’t continue attacking you and executed you the second you were down in the fight or whatever. She also didn’t call her entire Court to immediately rush to the hunting zone to come murder your ass or back her up when you starting crying on the comms.

You did everything wrong. You immediately escalated by calling your society to your aid and making it out as if she was purposely murdering you. You ignored her apologies. You STAKED HER. How many times do we have to explain it to you before it gets into that thick skull of yours.

YOU. STAKED. HER.

This is not a diplomatic approach. This is not a good-natured gesture of sportsmanship. This is not how you respond, ICly or OOCly, unless you literally wanted a full-blown war with blood spilled.

No patience. No compassion. No understanding. No sympathy. No communication. Nothing. Just ‘assume murder and go unhinged’. Real mature response, yeah.

[Kaiser]

Who cares if you think it’s justified IC or OOCly, why do you think that matters just because you get a log and read it like you understand a cherry picked moment in time, like their wasn’t death on the plate on my end. Once again everything to fit your narrative of Kaiser bad, Crayola innocent. You know what causes critical wounds too? Hunt Monsters.

Newbie rants? I’ve never once ranted in newbie. Lie.

Forum rants? Who started with the accusations and chiding? I know it’s hard for you to read, but not everything can be explained in 100 words or less.

[MojoJojo]

Not responding to this moronic rants of his any longer. Jog on. I hope we never cross paths and I’ll do anything in my power to fully avoid any and all interactions with you, no matter the circumstances or location. Thankfully, you’re about as obvious as RG and your chars stick out like a fresh turd in a fruit basket.

[Kaiser]

Yep, why don’t you ask her to show her OOC tirade of calling me bad faith and treating the game like a hack and slash, and my favorite so far: he has mental issues. Very cool, very mature. Ask her to also not doctor the tells, it wasn’t so sweet.

[MojoJojo]

Who started accusing? Let’s find out together…

“So, as of this post, New Haven is a murder roulette in its alpha or beta stages, as all the mechanics to make a PC dead work just fine, and are absolutely permanent. So your time can or will be absolutely robbed from you, until someone in “Nova’s” inner circle, a favorite, and so on experiences said inconveniences and then it may get an expedited fix. Until then, farewell mortals!”

Accusation one.

“Unfortunately I lagged out when I did retaliation RP, so I lost, and was instant executed (help execute) the moment combat dropped, and didn’t even get an RP scene; lame. Retaliation RP is absolutely a feature and intended in this game, but if Players and their “concepts” are just going to respond with instant executes or “justified” murders don’t embody this play as it is now another true moment of FAFO.”

Accusation two. (Also, the hypocrisy of ‘instant executes/murders/responses so bad wow’ as Mr Stakes Right Away Cause Assumed Murder)

“Before we begin: you, Crayola, and anyone else doesn’t know me from Adam; except for a select few, because I can actually trust them to ROLE play a character, be true to the scene, and embody the world they signed up to play in instead of getting lost in their feelings, taking anything they don’t agree with ICly and turn it into an OOC vendetta, or lambasting complete strangers and their moral character like some authority while armcharing their intentions. You don’t have any insight into my personal character or have an iota of the person behind the words, so stow it.”

Accusation three.

“she tries to play it off as “friendly fire,” but sees her actions as trying to use the Hunt as an opportunistic moment to murder him and blame it on the Hunt.”

Accusation four.

“Then through the abuse of AID and the breaking of rule 2 per Rules and Polices, PoF Arachne begins to harass me in AID; when I refused to pour oil on her fiery temper tantrum and horrible assumptions about me, so PoF Arachne takes it to OOC.”

Accusation five.

“At this point Crayola makes it very apparent that she is the PoF of Arachne. I’m told later in a tell that Crayola is dragging my name through the mud in OOC chat. I turn it back on to tell her to STFU and keep it IC and leave it at that; until she doesn’t and I troll report her for harassing me, character assassinating me, and the blatant rule breaking all because she has a victim complex and I was the “bad faith actor playing the game like it’s hack and slash.” Very cool, very mature.”

Accusation six.

“in the future that is not how RP is resolved against antagonistic scenes or strangers, and not a courtesy I was ever afforded, and is BLATANTLY against RULE TWO.”

Accusation seven. Good job throwing another random under the bus just to move the blame.

“We corner alleged murderer, they abuse code and initiate combat to exploit their Angel’s run speed. Lo and behold Arachne is nearby, smears Leon as the aggressor, calls in 4 Hand members, and knocks out Leon. And in typical Haven and Hand player fashion the moment Leon gets knocked out he’s instantly blindfolded, gagged, and bound. Very cool rp, not at all motivated by OOC grudges.”

Accusation eight.

Shall I continue? There’s more in these posts. This was all you, while the only response so far was Bean’s first comment.

[Erlkonig]

Fun facts about staking a vampire: if you stake them, they are paralyzed until the stake is removed. This has been the case since 1.0. By staking a vampire, you can effectively remove them from engagement for … a long time. Without killing them, by the way; it doesn’t kill them, it just makes them a vegetable. I’m not sure if they can re-roll while staked?

I recall someone re-rolling mid-conflict when they were staked, and we were left with a pile of ash. It was awkward.

Staking may not sound bad, but it is still a fairly severe method of dealing with another PC. It’s like tying them up and gagging them and then leaving them to just kinda … remain there, unable to do much. Hard to RP when a vegetable.

I am not saying it is unreasonable to stake a vampire. I am just saying it is a violent, severe method. Maybe it is in the character’s nature to automatically want all vampires out of commission. My character, if staked, would be offended. She would become the nightmare that bumps in the night, depending on how long she was staked and what happened while she was staked.

Is it possible that Crayola removed parts of her log to make herself look good? Sure. We won’t know unless we see some evidence that she said other things, which hasn’t been offered thus far.

I will remind everyone that sometimes, the IC thing to do is not the best thing to do from the OOC perspective. There are times when this game should be considered from the player’s perspective, under the question, “What is going to create the most fun for the people involved?” You should always do what is IC — but through the lens of “What is going to create the most fun for the people involved?”, what your character does may become less severe. These are things we learn as we grow as RPers, taking critique from other members of the community. Having an open mind to learn tips and tricks instead of being combative is a valuable aspect as a writer.

(Also, I’m sorry someone suggested you didn’t do enough, Stitch. That’s very inconsiderate of them, you did the best with what you had.)

[Kaiser]

Accusation one.
And, that’s pretty spot on, not calling people names, and a 100% accounting of the situation.
Accusation two. I didn’t stake right away, but keep pushing that lie.
Yep, Bean started this mess with, “you FAFO bro, what did you expect.” Now I had to clear the air, because them, and now you, have done nothing but in OOC tarnished my name. I don’t care if you know them, or are talking to them in discord, it’s all in this forum post now your uhinged “rants” and smears.
Accusation three.
Yep, Leon sees her as trying to play it off as friendly fire, and anyone else in that moment wouldn’t see it otherwise when they have 20is hp left and a Hunt Monster crawling up their ass. I know it’s hard for you to grasp, still, but I’m not my PC, Leon can think people are trying to hurt him in extremely tense and deathly situations.
Accusation four.
Yep, she was demanding RP, didn’t show all the AIDS, broke rule 2 and used AiD to control IC events, See Rule 2, and then went into OOC chat and threw a temper tantrum: “haven isn’t a hack and slash, and he a bad faith actor. Once again, keep up.” And today accused me of having, “mental issues.” Very nice person, very mature.
Accusation five.
Yep, when you out yourself in OOC and drag my name through the mud you don’t get to play the wounded creature and keep anonymity.
Accusation six.

Yep PoF Matias should not have used AiD to control IC events and scenes, especially of a stranger who did not give him permission to OOC contact him. See Rule 2.

Accusation seven.

Yep, Arachne furthered the antag when I let it die. I don’t know what you mean by a random? Didn’t you just throw a hissy fit about “PK?” I was elaborating on context and kept their name specifically out of it. So, not throwing under the bus.

Accusation eight.
Go ahead, you aren’t the genius debater you think you are. Aka what Luka was calling unhinged.

[MojoJojo]

Okay. Nice arguments. Doesn’t mean you didn’t start accusing. That’s.. exactly what you asked. Not that unhinged pointing out the obvious.

[Crayon]

I’ll be straight, from my OOC interactions with Kaiser for a minute now I’ve been pretty convinced that he’s a bad faith actor but until he around the time he started trying to get OOC homies to res him and posted his wildly inappropriate rule-breaking rant, I was actually convinced that Leon was played by a far-better but still occasionally problematic player with a penchant for much better video game knockoffs.

Sadly, this was not the case.

There has been no massive OOC hate campaign. I can count the number of people I talk to about Haven beyond memes and cat gifs on one finger.

When the vast majority of the playerbase is tired of your shit, it’s probably not because of a hateful conspiracy but because your shit smells.

[Kaiser]

@Erlkonig

When offered with charity, kindness, and an olive branch I’m right there with you that RP should be collaborative, but I can’t earnestly know in an IC only game what someone may find, “stinky.” This is when an adult uses humility and brevity to make requests, and certainly not demands guised as “requests.” Asking me to offer roleplay like I wasn’t trying to role play with a gank squad raining from the Heavens is a pretty rich and tall ask, and really passive aggressive.

Absolutely it’s violent, just like attacking someone and shooting them in the back when a Lava monster is about to kill them (Aka critically wound them codedly). But I’m sure someone will point to her log and say, “look she didn’t mean it” as some shield that IC actions don’t have IC consequences, and not acknowledging she didn’t explain herself with maturity and kindness in OOC or Tells to explain the flub. I dont’ know, be the change and all that?

Oh absolutely, what might be fun for some might be horrendous for others. Staking vampires is cool, I mean why are you playing a vampire if you think you’ll never be staked>? Once again, bad intel on Leon’s part, his f-up, his consequence, and his mistake he paid for.

Once again, assuming Leon was going to leave her staked is a bad characterization. The scene never had a chance to play out, but it didn’t matter but as I said he thought she was a vampire, and once the realization set she wasn’t a vampire, he and everyone in Temple agreed and/or through action tried her to get her to the hospital asap.

But within 60 seconds hit gank squad and ritual bombs on the loose.

[Author]

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